Discussion:
News on AIOE's outage
(too old to reply)
Don Spam's Reckless Son
2023-02-27 11:29:39 UTC
Permalink
Is there any site (or Newsgroup) which carries details of the AIOE
situation? Preferably a read-only one without all the self-indulgent OT
trolling.

What is known is that the Raid Controller failed catastrophically,
killing (at least) all of the transient data. My impression is that the
backups were not as helpful as one would have hoped.
Is AIOE going to make a comeback? There have been outages before but
this one has lasted a month and counting.
M***@dastardlyhq.com
2023-02-27 11:38:37 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 27 Feb 2023 12:29:39 +0100
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
Is there any site (or Newsgroup) which carries details of the AIOE
situation? Preferably a read-only one without all the self-indulgent OT
trolling.
What is known is that the Raid Controller failed catastrophically,
So much for RAID mitigating against data loss.
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
killing (at least) all of the transient data. My impression is that the
backups were not as helpful as one would have hoped.
Is AIOE going to make a comeback? There have been outages before but
this one has lasted a month and counting.
Setting up a server would take a morning so its probably a hardware issue,or
more specifically - money. Perhaps he simply doesn't have the funds to pay
for new kit.
Don Spam's Reckless Son
2023-02-27 12:02:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
On Mon, 27 Feb 2023 12:29:39 +0100
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
Is there any site (or Newsgroup) which carries details of the AIOE
situation? Preferably a read-only one without all the self-indulgent OT
trolling.
What is known is that the Raid Controller failed catastrophically,
So much for RAID mitigating against data loss.
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
killing (at least) all of the transient data. My impression is that the
backups were not as helpful as one would have hoped.
Is AIOE going to make a comeback? There have been outages before but
this one has lasted a month and counting.
Setting up a server would take a morning so its probably a hardware issue,or
more specifically - money. Perhaps he simply doesn't have the funds to pay
for new kit.
I'm wondering if he lost his code as well. That should not be the case,
but something has to explain this.
The raid controller has to be replaced (cost: under 100 € to over 2000
€) but I imagine the discs could still be useable.
This is still speculation and it would be good to know the facts.
Sn!pe
2023-02-27 12:43:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
On Mon, 27 Feb 2023 12:29:39 +0100
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
Is there any site (or Newsgroup) which carries details of the AIOE
situation? Preferably a read-only one without all the self-indulgent OT
trolling.
What is known is that the Raid Controller failed catastrophically,
So much for RAID mitigating against data loss.
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
killing (at least) all of the transient data. My impression is that the
backups were not as helpful as one would have hoped.
Is AIOE going to make a comeback? There have been outages before but
this one has lasted a month and counting.
Setting up a server would take a morning so its probably a hardware issue,or
more specifically - money. Perhaps he simply doesn't have the funds to pay
for new kit.
I'm wondering if he lost his code as well. That should not be the case,
but something has to explain this.
The raid controller has to be replaced (cost: under 100 € to over 2000
€) but I imagine the discs could still be useable.
This is still speculation and it would be good to know the facts.
The absence of any word whatsoever from Paolo makes me wonder
if he might have some Real Life issues to deal with that take a higher
priority than does his service.
--
^Ï^. – Sn!pe – My pet rock Gordon just is.

If you want peace, prepare for war.
Don Spam's Reckless Son
2023-02-27 14:05:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Sn!pe
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
On Mon, 27 Feb 2023 12:29:39 +0100
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
Is there any site (or Newsgroup) which carries details of the AIOE
situation? Preferably a read-only one without all the self-indulgent OT
trolling.
What is known is that the Raid Controller failed catastrophically,
So much for RAID mitigating against data loss.
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
killing (at least) all of the transient data. My impression is that the
backups were not as helpful as one would have hoped.
Is AIOE going to make a comeback? There have been outages before but
this one has lasted a month and counting.
Setting up a server would take a morning so its probably a hardware issue,or
more specifically - money. Perhaps he simply doesn't have the funds to pay
for new kit.
I'm wondering if he lost his code as well. That should not be the case,
but something has to explain this.
The raid controller has to be replaced (cost: under 100 € to over 2000
€) but I imagine the discs could still be useable.
This is still speculation and it would be good to know the facts.
The absence of any word whatsoever from Paolo makes me wonder
if he might have some Real Life issues to deal with that take a higher
priority than does his service.
Either that or he has turned his back on the project.

I have been looking at the public information on his site(s) and
discovered what most other people already knew, his server(s) are hosted
by "Leaseweb Deutschland" and are probably in Frankfurt. Does this not
mean that a hardware error is their problem?
M***@dastardlyhq.com
2023-02-27 15:30:51 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 27 Feb 2023 15:05:09 +0100
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
Post by Sn!pe
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
I'm wondering if he lost his code as well. That should not be the case,
but something has to explain this.
The raid controller has to be replaced (cost: under 100 € to over 2000
€) but I imagine the discs could still be useable.
This is still speculation and it would be good to know the facts.
The absence of any word whatsoever from Paolo makes me wonder
if he might have some Real Life issues to deal with that take a higher
priority than does his service.
Either that or he has turned his back on the project.
I have been looking at the public information on his site(s) and
discovered what most other people already knew, his server(s) are hosted
by "Leaseweb Deutschland" and are probably in Frankfurt. Does this not
mean that a hardware error is their problem?
AFAIK he didn't make any money from it, it was a hobby I suppose. Perhaps he
was getting fed up with running it and was thinking about quitting and this
simply forced his hand.
Grant Taylor
2023-02-28 00:01:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
AFAIK he didn't make any money from it, it was a hobby
I suppose. Perhaps he was getting fed up with running it and was
thinking about quitting and this simply forced his hand.
I have been operating news servers for more than a decade and AIOE has
always been professional and communicated as such /if/ /possible/.

As such, I'm taking it that AIOE will communicate if ~> when they can.

In the mean time let's give them the respect and space that they deserve
/ we would want if we were in their place.
--
Grant. . . .
unix || die
Sn!pe
2023-02-28 00:16:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by Grant Taylor
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
AFAIK he didn't make any money from it, it was a hobby
I suppose. Perhaps he was getting fed up with running it and was
thinking about quitting and this simply forced his hand.
I have been operating news servers for more than a decade and AIOE has
always been professional and communicated as such /if/ /possible/.
As such, I'm taking it that AIOE will communicate if ~> when they can.
In the mean time let's give them the respect and space that they deserve
/ we would want if we were in their place.
I recall that when Paolo started aioe he posted "I have a dream."

AIUI, it was all about providing Usenet access to those who couldn't
access it any other way due to government oppression, or whatever.
Unfortunately that meant it was also open to abusers. It must be
like 'Whack-A-Mole' to keep on top of that.
--
^Ï^. – Sn!pe – My pet rock Gordon just is.

If you want peace, prepare for war.
Nadegda
2023-02-28 02:57:16 UTC
Permalink
Time to trigger the right-wing snowflakes again. Melt, snowflakes, melt!
Post by Grant Taylor
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
AFAIK he didn't make any money from it, it was a hobby
I suppose. Perhaps he was getting fed up with running it and was
thinking about quitting and this simply forced his hand.
I have been operating news servers for more than a decade and AIOE has
always been professional and communicated as such /if/ /possible/.
As such, I'm taking it that AIOE will communicate if ~> when they can.
Well, unless Mr. Amoroso has been renditioned and is being held
incommunicado in a CIA black site or something, he absolutely could
communicate with us, even if that meant using a disposaphone and a
Starbucks WiFi or a public library computer and posting via mixmin. So,
he's not-communicating by choice, invalidating your hypothesis, or he
really has been kidnapped-or-worse.

(My guess is that your hypothesis is wrong.)
--
FNVWe Nadegda

"By all means, compare these shitheads to Nazis. Again and again. I'm with
you." -- Mike Godwin, Aug 13, 2017, 8:03 PM
Checkmate admits that, for all intents and purposes, he carries a teddy
bear in public: <***@news.alt.net>
M***@dastardlyhq.com
2023-02-28 08:39:24 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 27 Feb 2023 17:01:26 -0700
Post by Grant Taylor
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
AFAIK he didn't make any money from it, it was a hobby
I suppose. Perhaps he was getting fed up with running it and was
thinking about quitting and this simply forced his hand.
I have been operating news servers for more than a decade and AIOE has
always been professional and communicated as such /if/ /possible/.
As such, I'm taking it that AIOE will communicate if ~> when they can.
In the mean time let's give them the respect and space that they deserve
/ we would want if we were in their place.
Oh get a grip, its a just news server, no one died.
Tony
2023-03-03 19:21:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
On Mon, 27 Feb 2023 15:05:09 +0100
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
Post by Sn!pe
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
I'm wondering if he lost his code as well. That should not be the case,
but something has to explain this.
The raid controller has to be replaced (cost: under 100 € to over 2000
€) but I imagine the discs could still be useable.
This is still speculation and it would be good to know the facts.
The absence of any word whatsoever from Paolo makes me wonder
if he might have some Real Life issues to deal with that take a higher
priority than does his service.
Either that or he has turned his back on the project.
I have been looking at the public information on his site(s) and
discovered what most other people already knew, his server(s) are hosted
by "Leaseweb Deutschland" and are probably in Frankfurt. Does this not
mean that a hardware error is their problem?
AFAIK he didn't make any money from it, it was a hobby I suppose. Perhaps he
was getting fed up with running it and was thinking about quitting and this
simply forced his hand.
THe guy has a hangup on people using too much bandwidth. He still thinks
its the year 1983.
noel
2023-02-28 03:40:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
his server(s) are hosted
by "Leaseweb Deutschland" and are probably in Frankfurt. Does this not
mean that a hardware error is their problem?
not if it is "his" server, as is being speculated, they just provide the
rackspace, power and transit.
Paul
2023-02-28 09:00:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by noel
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
his server(s) are hosted
by "Leaseweb Deutschland" and are probably in Frankfurt. Does this not
mean that a hardware error is their problem?
not if it is "his" server, as is being speculated, they just provide the
rackspace, power and transit.
Feb28,2023

ping news.aioe.org

Pinging news.aioe.org [46.165.242.91] with 32 bytes of data:
Reply from 46.165.242.91: bytes=32 time=113ms TTL=52
Reply from 46.165.242.91: bytes=32 time=113ms TTL=52
Reply from 46.165.242.91: bytes=32 time=113ms TTL=52
Reply from 46.165.242.91: bytes=32 time=113ms TTL=52

Now, check on Wednesday March 1st, 2023, and see if the ping is still there.

That is all that is left of the server. If you try any other well-known
symbolic addresses for that server domain, they don't answer.

*******

This means leaseweb has completed their responsibilities,
which is to provide a machine with at least one IP address answering.

If one IP is answering, Paolo can shell in and get to work.

This machine could be a nuke and pave, or an entirely different
rack in the COLO. The loss of the RAID, could have been a
motherboard or a power supply failure, and Leaseweb, their level
of tech support for the lowest tier of rental, is not going
to be a "thoughtful" or "involved" process. It's not a
concierge service with white gloves and hot towels for the renter :-)
It's just a cold computer in a cold computer center, and
several cold hard drives cooled by massive air conditioners.

The renter has to breathe life into it. There would be a base
OS, and then any applications are set up by the renter.

Paolo should know about backups, after the other total nuke job
years ago. If you don't back up anything, at least copying the
config files would be a big help in a (later) emergency.

Paul
Don Spam's Reckless Son
2023-02-28 11:33:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Paul
Post by noel
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
his server(s) are hosted
by "Leaseweb Deutschland" and are probably in Frankfurt.  Does this not
mean that a hardware error is their problem?
not if it is "his" server, as is being speculated, they just provide the
rackspace, power and transit.
Feb28,2023
ping news.aioe.org
Reply from 46.165.242.91: bytes=32 time=113ms TTL=52
Reply from 46.165.242.91: bytes=32 time=113ms TTL=52
Reply from 46.165.242.91: bytes=32 time=113ms TTL=52
Reply from 46.165.242.91: bytes=32 time=113ms TTL=52
Now, check on Wednesday March 1st, 2023, and see if the ping is still there.
That is all that is left of the server. If you try any other well-known
symbolic addresses for that server domain, they don't answer.
*******
This means leaseweb has completed their responsibilities,
which is to provide a machine with at least one IP address answering.
If one IP is answering, Paolo can shell in and get to work.
This machine could be a nuke and pave, or an entirely different
rack in the COLO. The loss of the RAID, could have been a
motherboard or a power supply failure, and Leaseweb, their level
of tech support for the lowest tier of rental, is not going
to be a "thoughtful" or "involved" process. It's not a
concierge service with white gloves and hot towels for the renter :-)
It's just a cold computer in a cold computer center, and
several cold hard drives cooled by massive air conditioners.
The renter has to breathe life into it. There would be a base
OS, and then any applications are set up by the renter.
Paolo should know about backups, after the other total nuke job
years ago. If you don't back up anything, at least copying the
config files would be a big help in a (later) emergency.
   Paul
The fun thing is, when I'm in Germany (which is a lot of the time) the
hosting company is around 15 minutes on a bicycle from where I am. Not
that that helps in the slightest.
noel
2023-02-28 12:47:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Paul
Feb28,2023
ping news.aioe.org
Reply from 46.165.242.91: bytes=32 time=113ms TTL=52 Reply from
bytes=32 time=113ms TTL=52 Reply from 46.165.242.91: bytes=32 time=113ms
TTL=52
Now, check on Wednesday March 1st, 2023, and see if the ping is still there.
That is all that is left of the server. If you try any other well-known
symbolic addresses for that server domain, they don't answer.
*******
Paolo should know about backups, after the other total nuke job years
ago. If you don't back up anything, at least copying the config files
would be a big help in a (later) emergency.
Paul
~$ ping news-in.aioe.org
PING news-in.aioe.org (46.165.242.75) 56(84) bytes of data.
From po-2.ce07.fra-01.de.leaseweb.net (212.95.37.31) icmp_seq=1
Destination Host Unreachable
From po-2.ce07.fra-01.de.leaseweb.net (212.95.37.31) icmp_seq=2
Destination Host Unreachable
From po-2.ce07.fra-01.de.leaseweb.net (212.95.37.31) icmp_seq=3
Destination Host Unreachable
From po-2.ce07.fra-01.de.leaseweb.net (212.95.37.31) icmp_seq=4
Destination Host Unreachable
From po-2.ce07.fra-01.de.leaseweb.net (212.95.37.31) icmp_seq=5
Destination Host Unreachable
Tony
2023-03-03 19:20:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
Post by Sn!pe
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
On Mon, 27 Feb 2023 12:29:39 +0100
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
Is there any site (or Newsgroup) which carries details of the AIOE
situation?  Preferably a read-only one without all the
self-indulgent OT
trolling.
What is known is that the Raid Controller failed catastrophically,
So much for RAID mitigating against data loss.
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
killing (at least) all of the transient data.  My impression is
that the
backups were not as helpful as one would have hoped.
Is AIOE going to make a comeback?  There have been outages before but
this one has lasted a month and counting.
Setting up a server would take a morning so its probably a hardware issue,or
more specifically - money. Perhaps he simply doesn't have the funds to pay
for new kit.
I'm wondering if he lost his code as well.  That should not be the case,
but something has to explain this.
The raid controller has to be replaced (cost: under 100 € to over 2000
€) but I imagine the discs could still be useable.
This is still speculation and it would be good to know the facts.
The absence of any word whatsoever from Paolo makes me wonder
if he might have some Real Life issues to deal with that take a higher
priority than does his service.
Either that or he has turned his back on the project.
I have been looking at the public information on his site(s) and
discovered what most other people already knew, his server(s) are hosted
by "Leaseweb Deutschland" and are probably in Frankfurt.  Does this not
mean that a hardware error is their problem?
Or his alarm clock broke and he's still asleep.
Tony
2023-03-03 19:19:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Sn!pe
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
On Mon, 27 Feb 2023 12:29:39 +0100
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
Is there any site (or Newsgroup) which carries details of the AIOE
situation? Preferably a read-only one without all the self-indulgent OT
trolling.
What is known is that the Raid Controller failed catastrophically,
So much for RAID mitigating against data loss.
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
killing (at least) all of the transient data. My impression is that the
backups were not as helpful as one would have hoped.
Is AIOE going to make a comeback? There have been outages before but
this one has lasted a month and counting.
Setting up a server would take a morning so its probably a hardware issue,or
more specifically - money. Perhaps he simply doesn't have the funds to pay
for new kit.
I'm wondering if he lost his code as well. That should not be the case,
but something has to explain this.
The raid controller has to be replaced (cost: under 100 € to over 2000
€) but I imagine the discs could still be useable.
This is still speculation and it would be good to know the facts.
The absence of any word whatsoever from Paolo makes me wonder
if he might have some Real Life issues to deal with that take a higher
priority than does his service.
AIOE is supposed to take top priority due to all the school children who
now can't learn anything on usenet. Eternal September the guy who runs
it is a snob and I don't use servers that people like that own. Avi
Frreman or Freedman and that silent patient spider crap and who cares
about patient spiders?
M***@dastardlyhq.com
2023-03-04 09:55:15 UTC
Permalink
On Fri, 3 Mar 2023 14:19:46 -0500
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
Post by Sn!pe
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
On Mon, 27 Feb 2023 12:29:39 +0100
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
Is there any site (or Newsgroup) which carries details of the AIOE
situation? Preferably a read-only one without all the self-indulgent OT
trolling.
What is known is that the Raid Controller failed catastrophically,
So much for RAID mitigating against data loss.
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
killing (at least) all of the transient data. My impression is that the
backups were not as helpful as one would have hoped.
Is AIOE going to make a comeback? There have been outages before but
this one has lasted a month and counting.
Setting up a server would take a morning so its probably a hardware
issue,or
Post by Sn!pe
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
more specifically - money. Perhaps he simply doesn't have the funds to pay
for new kit.
I'm wondering if he lost his code as well. That should not be the case,
but something has to explain this.
The raid controller has to be replaced (cost: under 100 € to over 2000
€) but I imagine the discs could still be useable.
This is still speculation and it would be good to know the facts.
The absence of any word whatsoever from Paolo makes me wonder
if he might have some Real Life issues to deal with that take a higher
priority than does his service.
AIOE is supposed to take top priority due to all the school children who
now can't learn anything on usenet. Eternal September the guy who runs
How many kids ever used usenet even in the 90s, never mind now?
William Stickers
2023-03-04 10:20:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
On Fri, 3 Mar 2023 14:19:46 -0500
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
Post by Sn!pe
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
On Mon, 27 Feb 2023 12:29:39 +0100
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
Is there any site (or Newsgroup) which carries details of the AIOE
situation? Preferably a read-only one without all the self-indulgent OT
trolling.
What is known is that the Raid Controller failed catastrophically,
So much for RAID mitigating against data loss.
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
killing (at least) all of the transient data. My impression is that the
backups were not as helpful as one would have hoped.
Is AIOE going to make a comeback? There have been outages before but
this one has lasted a month and counting.
Setting up a server would take a morning so its probably a hardware
issue,or
Post by Sn!pe
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
more specifically - money. Perhaps he simply doesn't have the funds to pay
for new kit.
I'm wondering if he lost his code as well. That should not be the case,
but something has to explain this.
The raid controller has to be replaced (cost: under 100 â?¬ to over 2000
â?¬) but I imagine the discs could still be useable.
This is still speculation and it would be good to know the facts.
The absence of any word whatsoever from Paolo makes me wonder
if he might have some Real Life issues to deal with that take a higher
priority than does his service.
AIOE is supposed to take top priority due to all the school children who
now can't learn anything on usenet. Eternal September the guy who runs
How many kids ever used usenet even in the 90s, never mind now?
Tony ain't the sharpest tool in the box.
Nadegda
2023-03-06 13:32:34 UTC
Permalink
Time to trigger the right-wing snowflakes again. Melt, snowflakes, melt!
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
How many kids ever used usenet even in the 90s, never mind now?
Just the ones whose chronological age is much higher than their maturity.

<snicker>
--
FNVWe Nadegda

"By all means, compare these shitheads to Nazis. Again and again. I'm with
you." -- Mike Godwin, Aug 13, 2017, 8:03 PM
Checkmate admits that, for all intents and purposes, he carries a teddy
bear in public: <***@news.alt.net>
phigan
2023-03-15 04:21:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by Nadegda
Time to trigger the right-wing snowflakes again. Melt, snowflakes, melt!
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
How many kids ever used usenet even in the 90s, never mind now?
Just the ones whose chronological age is much higher than their maturity.
I used Usenet a bunch as a kid in the 90s. At the time, my maturity
level was higher... but at some point my chronolical age passed that and
kept on goin'.
phigan
2023-04-16 07:05:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by phigan
I used Usenet a bunch as a kid in the 90s. At the time, my maturity
level was higher... but at some point my chronolical age passed that and
kept on goin'.
did this actually make it out anywhere?

OldbieOne
2023-03-08 21:24:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
On Fri, 3 Mar 2023 14:19:46 -0500
<snip>
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
Post by Tony
AIOE is supposed to take top priority due to all the school children who
now can't learn anything on usenet. Eternal September the guy who runs
How many kids ever used usenet even in the 90s, never mind now?
I was about 8 when I first accessed USENET....

Something tells me that the average age on USENET now has to be 55+ except
for maybe one or two younger ped0s who should be arrested and hung by their
***@lls until dead.


--
OldbieOne (TM)
The One Who Tells It Like It Is
Brought to you by RetroPC
Shadow
2023-03-08 22:03:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by OldbieOne
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
On Fri, 3 Mar 2023 14:19:46 -0500
<snip>
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
Post by Tony
AIOE is supposed to take top priority due to all the school children who
now can't learn anything on usenet. Eternal September the guy who runs
How many kids ever used usenet even in the 90s, never mind now?
I was about 8 when I first accessed USENET....
In 1980? That would make you ~51 today.
Post by OldbieOne
Something tells me that the average age on USENET now has to be 55+ except
for maybe one or two younger ped0s who should be arrested and hung by their
LOL
[]'s
--
Don't be evil - Google 2004
We have a new policy - Google 2012
Google Fuchsia - 2021
OldbieOne
2023-03-09 18:51:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by Shadow
Post by OldbieOne
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
On Fri, 3 Mar 2023 14:19:46 -0500
<snip>
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
Post by Tony
AIOE is supposed to take top priority due to all the school children who
now can't learn anything on usenet. Eternal September the guy who runs
How many kids ever used usenet even in the 90s, never mind now?
I was about 8 when I first accessed USENET....
In 1980? That would make you ~51 today.
Post by OldbieOne
Something tells me that the average age on USENET now has to be 55+ except
for maybe one or two younger ped0s who should be arrested and hung by their
LOL
You math well :P
M***@dastardlyhq.com
2023-03-09 09:08:50 UTC
Permalink
On Wed, 8 Mar 2023 16:24:51 -0500
Post by OldbieOne
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
On Fri, 3 Mar 2023 14:19:46 -0500
<snip>
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
Post by Tony
AIOE is supposed to take top priority due to all the school children who
now can't learn anything on usenet. Eternal September the guy who runs
How many kids ever used usenet even in the 90s, never mind now?
I was about 8 when I first accessed USENET....
Something tells me that the average age on USENET now has to be 55+ except
for maybe one or two younger ped0s who should be arrested and hung by their
I'm < 55. First used usenet when I was at uni in the 90s.
OldbieOne
2023-03-09 18:50:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
On Wed, 8 Mar 2023 16:24:51 -0500
Post by OldbieOne
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
On Fri, 3 Mar 2023 14:19:46 -0500
<snip>
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
Post by Tony
AIOE is supposed to take top priority due to all the school children who
now can't learn anything on usenet. Eternal September the guy who runs
How many kids ever used usenet even in the 90s, never mind now?
I was about 8 when I first accessed USENET....
Something tells me that the average age on USENET now has to be 55+ except
for maybe one or two younger ped0s who should be arrested and hung by their
I'm < 55. First used usenet when I was at uni in the 90s.
If you were 18 in the 90's you're not too far behind ;)

My first experience with USENET was a limited feed via the BBS my father was
a user of
in the late 80's, but I was pretty much using USENET regularly by way of my
ISP's provided
NNTP service and through college access from the early 90's until it's
"death" in the post-9/11
culling.

I don't think it'll ever be the same as it was, but I'm glad that it's still
here in some form or other.
Imagine More Meat
2023-03-10 10:00:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by OldbieOne
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
On Wed, 8 Mar 2023 16:24:51 -0500
Post by OldbieOne
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
On Fri, 3 Mar 2023 14:19:46 -0500
<snip>
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
Post by Tony
AIOE is supposed to take top priority due to all the school children
who
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
Post by OldbieOne
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
Post by Tony
now can't learn anything on usenet. Eternal September the guy who runs
How many kids ever used usenet even in the 90s, never mind now?
I was about 8 when I first accessed USENET....
Something tells me that the average age on USENET now has to be 55+
except
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
Post by OldbieOne
for maybe one or two younger ped0s who should be arrested and hung by
their
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
I'm < 55. First used usenet when I was at uni in the 90s.
If you were 18 in the 90's you're not too far behind ;)
My first experience with USENET was a limited feed via the BBS my father was
a user of
in the late 80's, but I was pretty much using USENET regularly by way of my
ISP's provided
NNTP service and through college access from the early 90's until it's
"death" in the post-9/11
culling.
I don't think it'll ever be the same as it was, but I'm glad that it's still
here in some form or other.
What if you made it better than it ever was?

What is stopping you anons from getting together and making the code to
improve it?

There are many things that could be improved to make NNTP a frictionless
experience for users and admins. Friction is death bane for software.

Improve or re-invent the protocol. Remove the unnecessary functions of
the protocol to streamline it. Simplify the left-over functions for
asynchronous exchange instead of requiring a keep-alive session. Use
signed tokens to order the commands in each session so that the session
can be continued where it left off even several minutes in between
connections and commands.

Improve the client. Fork a GUI client and make it better.

Improve the server and client so that configuration of accounts is
always automatic and not prone to user error or arcane options causing
failures.

Improve the server. Make it a point-click install experience. Make it so
mere mortals can be up and running in no time.

Imagine a NNTP server with a GUI configuration and a setup wizard to get
all the options right.

Imagine a NNTP server that automatically generates TLS keys and ensures
all connections are encryption.

Imagine a NNTP server that automatically registers letsencrypt keys.

Imagine a built-in web front end with automated user registration and
verification.

Imagine easy checkboxes to make some groups open and make some groups
require registration.

Imagine extra features like hidden newsgroups, secret newsgroups, and
author message cancellation.

Imagine extra encryption options built-in.

Imagine easy configuration for partial or small feed syncing to preserve
bandwidth.

Imagine optional mix routing built-in to the client and the servers.

Imagine high-level spam handling in the GUI interface.

Imagine keyword and sender filtering at the server level.

It looks like RetroGuy at RocksolidBBS.com is already on this track. You
could fork his code and hack away and push back improvements.

Imagine.

Write the code.

Run more servers.

Profit!
--
Imagine More Meat!
M***@dastardlyhq.com
2023-03-10 10:09:56 UTC
Permalink
On Fri, 10 Mar 2023 04:00:39 -0600
Post by Imagine More Meat
Post by OldbieOne
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
On Wed, 8 Mar 2023 16:24:51 -0500
Post by OldbieOne
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
On Fri, 3 Mar 2023 14:19:46 -0500
<snip>
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
Post by Tony
AIOE is supposed to take top priority due to all the school children
who
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
Post by OldbieOne
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
Post by Tony
now can't learn anything on usenet. Eternal September the guy who runs
How many kids ever used usenet even in the 90s, never mind now?
I was about 8 when I first accessed USENET....
Something tells me that the average age on USENET now has to be 55+
except
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
Post by OldbieOne
for maybe one or two younger ped0s who should be arrested and hung by
their
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
I'm < 55. First used usenet when I was at uni in the 90s.
If you were 18 in the 90's you're not too far behind ;)
My first experience with USENET was a limited feed via the BBS my father was
a user of
in the late 80's, but I was pretty much using USENET regularly by way of my
ISP's provided
NNTP service and through college access from the early 90's until it's
"death" in the post-9/11
culling.
I don't think it'll ever be the same as it was, but I'm glad that it's still
here in some form or other.
What if you made it better than it ever was?
What is stopping you anons from getting together and making the code to
improve it?
There are many things that could be improved to make NNTP a frictionless
experience for users and admins. Friction is death bane for software.
What a load of completely missing the point gibberish.

The network protocol/API isn't the issue any more than than it is for
facebook vs tik-tok.

Go get a clue.
Troll Alert
2023-03-10 12:45:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
On Fri, 10 Mar 2023 04:00:39 -0600
Post by Imagine More Meat
Post by OldbieOne
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
On Wed, 8 Mar 2023 16:24:51 -0500
Post by OldbieOne
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
On Fri, 3 Mar 2023 14:19:46 -0500
<snip>
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
Post by Tony
AIOE is supposed to take top priority due to all the school children
who
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
Post by OldbieOne
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
Post by Tony
now can't learn anything on usenet. Eternal September the guy who runs
How many kids ever used usenet even in the 90s, never mind now?
I was about 8 when I first accessed USENET....
Something tells me that the average age on USENET now has to be 55+
except
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
Post by OldbieOne
for maybe one or two younger ped0s who should be arrested and hung by
their
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
I'm < 55. First used usenet when I was at uni in the 90s.
If you were 18 in the 90's you're not too far behind ;)
My first experience with USENET was a limited feed via the BBS my father was
a user of
in the late 80's, but I was pretty much using USENET regularly by way of my
ISP's provided
NNTP service and through college access from the early 90's until it's
"death" in the post-9/11
culling.
I don't think it'll ever be the same as it was, but I'm glad that it's still
here in some form or other.
What if you made it better than it ever was?
What is stopping you anons from getting together and making the code to
improve it?
There are many things that could be improved to make NNTP a frictionless
experience for users and admins. Friction is death bane for software.
What a load of completely missing the point gibberish.
The network protocol/API isn't the issue any more than than it is for
facebook vs tik-tok.
Go get a clue.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
👾 👿 💀 👽 👻 👺 👹
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
❗ TROLL ALERT
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
❎ TROLL DETECTED
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
💩 TYPE: KNOW-IT-ALL BUREAUCRAT TROLL
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
👿 TACTIC: YOU ARE NOT RELEVANT
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
⛔ WARNING: DO NOT ENGAGE!
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
OldbieOne
2023-03-10 14:44:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
Post by Imagine More Meat
What is stopping you anons from getting together and making the code to
improve it?
There are many things that could be improved to make NNTP a frictionless
experience for users and admins. Friction is death bane for software.
What a load of completely missing the point gibberish.
The network protocol/API isn't the issue any more than than it is for
facebook vs tik-tok.
Exactly! Well said, Sir, well said!


--
OldbieOne [TM]
The One Who Tells It Like It is!
Brought to you by RetroPC
OldbieOne
2023-03-10 14:43:40 UTC
Permalink
On Fri, 10 Mar 2023 04:00:39 -0600, Imagine More Meat <***@more.meat> did
make me awaken from my chaotic existentialism when they didst announce:

<snipped>
Post by Imagine More Meat
Post by OldbieOne
I don't think it'll ever be the same as it was, but I'm glad that it's still
here in some form or other.
What if you made it better than it ever was?
Ok, I'll bite....
Post by Imagine More Meat
What is stopping you anons from getting together and making the code to
improve it?
The fact that to do so would require reinventing the technology stack from the
protocol level on up.
Post by Imagine More Meat
There are many things that could be improved to make NNTP a frictionless
experience for users and admins. Friction is death bane for software.
NNTP was largely "frictionless" by design

To create a group, you simply send a control message to your server and all
interconnected servers, by design, would replicate the group's feed.

This was the original purpose of the NNTP protocol.

The protocol is not "at fault" here.....

ISP/IAP's aka "server owners" are to blame.

Once ISPs were leaned on by their Corporate Overlords, many admins (aka internet
provider companies) started messing with their feeds to exclude groups they
didn't like or want to carry on their servers for political, or financial
reasons (warez, pr0n, politcal opposition, etc).

This resulted in different groups being carried by different servers around the
world which effectively breaks the "frictionless" experience of the NNTP design.

There's nothing wrong with NNTP. It's the way it's currently implemented.

The fact is that governments around the world didn't like USENET because of the
freedom to post information that gets globally promulgated automatically.

Corporations hated it because IP was consistently leaked to USENET and globally
propagated, resulting in massive copyright theft.

<snipped>
Post by Imagine More Meat
Improve the client. Fork a GUI client and make it better.
There are many great GUI based clients out there. Sure, the look and feel could
do with being updated, but with how few NNTP services there are currently on the
global internet, and how few the user base is, it would not make fiscal sense
for companies to invest in updating the clients they currently offer.

There isn't any driver for the open source community to make a more modern
looking interface either, in that it would be a lot of work for only a very
small subset of people who access the internet.
Post by Imagine More Meat
Improve the server and client so that configuration of accounts is
always automatic and not prone to user error or arcane options causing
failures.
Improve the server. Make it a point-click install experience. Make it so
mere mortals can be up and running in no time.
This is outside of the NNTP protocol itself. There would need to be a new RFC
which would require the buy-in of the companies currently hosting servers to
work towards creating a new standard for account creation and authorization.
That would take time and resources to be assigned to it.

It would require investment.

See where I'm going with this?
Post by Imagine More Meat
Imagine a NNTP server with a GUI configuration and a setup wizard to get
all the options right.
Imagine a NNTP server that automatically generates TLS keys and ensures
all connections are encryption.
Sure. Imagine ISPs and hosting companies that are still in the game, all pouring
money into first creating a new internet standard for NNTP authentication, and
then imagine them pouring more money into design and implementation of the new
RFC.

There are also legal hurdles, which I'll touch on below.
Post by Imagine More Meat
Imagine extra features like hidden newsgroups, secret newsgroups, and
author message cancellation.
Now you're touching on the protocol itself. This would require a commpletely new
protocol and standards in and of itself. See above arguments for why this is not
possible (RFC, global agreement of provders, investment....).

The reason NNTP was once so widely implemented, was because of its SIMPLICITY.
You post to a group. It gets replicated. You create a new group, it gets
replicated. It was all automatic, and required little "care and feeding". USENET
was CHEAP and required little to no investment to host.
Post by Imagine More Meat
Imagine high-level spam handling in the GUI interface.
Imagine keyword and sender filtering at the server level.
It looks like RetroGuy at RocksolidBBS.com is already on this track. You
could fork his code and hack away and push back improvements.
I have a lot of respect for RetroGuy's skills and dedication. But without
creating new standards (RFC) and without IAP/ISP buy-in, what he's creating is
simply a hobbyist network. If it catches on, maybe it could grow past that, but
there are several other factors that would likely prevent that or stop it.

I think it's important to look outside of the technical possibilities, and take
a look at the cold, hard reality.

Since 2001 the relationship between governments and ISP/IAPs, have resuled in a
cadre of different laws around the world on what can/cannot be posted to the
internet or made available online, either globally, or within each government's
jurisdiction.

Some of these are due to the rise in global terrorism, others are due to the
global war on drugs, others are due to closed regimes not wanting external
information to be made available to their populations, and others are due to the
very neccessary laws on child protection.

It is likely that if a new network of USENET servers came online offering strong

encryption, hidden/closed groups, etc, and seemed to be poised to expand well
outside of the hobbyist community, governments and ISP/IAPs would react.
Strongly.

We would likely see legal requirements effectively legislate them out of
existance, and/or ISP/IAPs blocking any traffic to or from those servers. Most
of the justifications for doing so would be because of the POTENTIAL for IP
theft, child porn, and/or domestic/international terrorism, which would have
widespread instititional, corporate, and public support.

Again, I have a lot of respect for RetroGuy, but I'm sure even he doesn't see
any potential in this outside of a mostly closed space for hobbyists and
like-minded individuals.


--
OldbieOne [TM]
The One Who Tells It Like It is!
Brought to you by RetroPC
Tony
2023-03-03 19:15:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by M***@dastardlyhq.com
On Mon, 27 Feb 2023 12:29:39 +0100
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
Is there any site (or Newsgroup) which carries details of the AIOE
situation? Preferably a read-only one without all the self-indulgent OT
trolling.
What is known is that the Raid Controller failed catastrophically,
So much for RAID mitigating against data loss.
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
killing (at least) all of the transient data. My impression is that the
backups were not as helpful as one would have hoped.
Is AIOE going to make a comeback? There have been outages before but
this one has lasted a month and counting.
Setting up a server would take a morning so its probably a hardware issue,or
more specifically - money. Perhaps he simply doesn't have the funds to pay
for new kit.
Maybe someone he knows can fork over a couple of bucks so he can fix it.
I think of the elementary children who aren't able to learn now that
AIOE is down so long.
Nadegda
2023-02-28 02:47:42 UTC
Permalink
Time to trigger the right-wing snowflakes again. Melt, snowflakes, melt!
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
Is there any site (or Newsgroup) which carries details of the AIOE
situation? Preferably a read-only one without all the self-indulgent OT
trolling.
What is known is that the Raid Controller failed catastrophically,
killing (at least) all of the transient data. My impression is that the
backups were not as helpful as one would have hoped.
Is AIOE going to make a comeback? There have been outages before but
this one has lasted a month and counting.
I suspect sabotage. At this point, if Mr. Amoroso had simply started over
from scratch with all necessary hardware repairs and a blank-slate OS and
news-server install, it would be back to normal modulo reset article-
numbering, though for the past month the retention would have seemed less
than normal until it had spent a full month receiving articles into its
spool. From this day on though it would not have been obvious that anything
had happened.

If it's taking longer to bring it back than the most drastic possible case
for repair (i.e., total loss of all pre-existing data and the hardware
needing rebuilding), that can only mean that whatever knocked it offline
wasn't a one-and-done but is still actively impeding things, which in turn
suggests some type of denial-of-service attack. (The other, more disturbing
but less likely, possibility being that it was/is an inside job.)

Is anyone controversial known for posting through that server? IIRC kensi
used to use it and she has quite a long enemies list ... maybe one of them
thought she was still using it and launched this attack.
--
FNVWe Nadegda

"By all means, compare these shitheads to Nazis. Again and again. I'm with
you." -- Mike Godwin, Aug 13, 2017, 8:03 PM
Checkmate admits that, for all intents and purposes, he carries a teddy
bear in public: <***@news.alt.net>
Tony
2023-03-03 19:25:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by Nadegda
Time to trigger the right-wing snowflakes again. Melt, snowflakes, melt!
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
Is there any site (or Newsgroup) which carries details of the AIOE
situation? Preferably a read-only one without all the self-indulgent OT
trolling.
What is known is that the Raid Controller failed catastrophically,
killing (at least) all of the transient data. My impression is that the
backups were not as helpful as one would have hoped.
Is AIOE going to make a comeback? There have been outages before but
this one has lasted a month and counting.
I suspect sabotage. At this point, if Mr. Amoroso had simply started over
from scratch with all necessary hardware repairs and a blank-slate OS and
news-server install, it would be back to normal modulo reset article-
numbering, though for the past month the retention would have seemed less
than normal until it had spent a full month receiving articles into its
spool. From this day on though it would not have been obvious that anything
had happened.
If it's taking longer to bring it back than the most drastic possible case
for repair (i.e., total loss of all pre-existing data and the hardware
needing rebuilding), that can only mean that whatever knocked it offline
wasn't a one-and-done but is still actively impeding things, which in turn
suggests some type of denial-of-service attack. (The other, more disturbing
but less likely, possibility being that it was/is an inside job.)
Is anyone controversial known for posting through that server? IIRC kensi
used to use it and she has quite a long enemies list ... maybe one of them
thought she was still using it and launched this attack.
Well if the guy had of listened to that bondeheaded chuckcar and did
backups this mess wou9ldn't have occurred. To be fair all of chuckcar's
advice will eviscerate your computer.
Don Spam's Reckless Son
2023-04-04 18:54:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by Nadegda
Time to trigger the right-wing snowflakes again. Melt, snowflakes, melt!
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
Is there any site (or Newsgroup) which carries details of the AIOE
situation? Preferably a read-only one without all the self-indulgent OT
trolling.
What is known is that the Raid Controller failed catastrophically,
killing (at least) all of the transient data. My impression is that the
backups were not as helpful as one would have hoped.
Is AIOE going to make a comeback? There have been outages before but
this one has lasted a month and counting.
I suspect sabotage. At this point, if Mr. Amoroso had simply started over
from scratch with all necessary hardware repairs and a blank-slate OS and
news-server install, it would be back to normal modulo reset article-
numbering, though for the past month the retention would have seemed less
than normal until it had spent a full month receiving articles into its
spool. From this day on though it would not have been obvious that anything
had happened.
If it's taking longer to bring it back than the most drastic possible case
for repair (i.e., total loss of all pre-existing data and the hardware
needing rebuilding), that can only mean that whatever knocked it offline
wasn't a one-and-done but is still actively impeding things, which in turn
suggests some type of denial-of-service attack. (The other, more disturbing
but less likely, possibility being that it was/is an inside job.)
Is anyone controversial known for posting through that server? IIRC kensi
used to use it and she has quite a long enemies list ... maybe one of them
thought she was still using it and launched this attack.
Five weeks later, it's gone and I very much doubt that it is ever coming
back. No news is not good news in this case.
Tony
2023-03-18 23:01:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by Don Spam's Reckless Son
Is there any site (or Newsgroup) which carries details of the AIOE
situation?  Preferably a read-only one without all the self-indulgent OT
trolling.
What is known is that the Raid Controller failed catastrophically,
killing (at least) all of the transient data.  My impression is that the
backups were not as helpful as one would have hoped.
Is AIOE going to make a comeback?  There have been outages before but
this one has lasted a month and counting.
He mustn't be an Irishman because AIOE was still busted on St. Patrick's
Day.
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